I've known Mike Conway for a while now.  Since I'm a reviewer and he's a film maker, I bet you can guess how we first came into contact with one another.  His film making talent is well known in certain indie circles, and with every new film he makes, he breaks new ground and always comes out of it with lots of great new stories to tell.  Recently I interviewed Mike about his new film Exile, in which things on the production end didn't exactly go as planned.  In the following interview, Mike talks about those production issues, how he overcame them, his future plans and a whole lot more.

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Ok, it's been a while, so let's have you re-introduce yourself to everyone and tell us about your background as a film maker.

I'm an indie filmmaker who has made films in Arizona, Nevada and Utah.  I'm a Univ. of Arizona graduate.  Las Vegas has been my home city, for the last 16 years.  I started out making Super 8 and 16mm shorts in the 80's.  I love Hollywood movies, but I don't want the hustle bustle of Los Angeles.  I'm trying to make it by producing my own features and tutorials from my home.  I just finished my 4th feature, EXILE.  Like most of my flicks, I produced, wrote and directed.   

I am drawn to sci-fi, horror, thrillers and comedy.  I like doing action, while keeping the dialogue rooted in character drama.  James Cameron is the best at bringing drama to genre films.  I like that path and always have, since Ridley Scott's ALIEN was released.  My favorite movie, btw.



You had gotten the idea for Exile back in 2006 I believe it was.  You had just started talking about it when I was hanging out with you at the It Came From Lake Michigan film festival.  Tell us about your original ideas for the film and how you had originally envisioned the film as you were writing it.  How did these original visions compare with the final result?


In the early 90's I had an idea for a movie called SPECIMEN.  From that idea, I pulled the scripts for TERRARIUM and EXILE.  There was no android in that, but there was the "blind pilot" idea.  A few years ago, I was asked to write a sci-fi story and it was right after we wrapped THE AWAKENING.  One of the stars, Heather Lei Guzzetta, had the kind of demeanor that I could see fitting an android role.  I immediately thought of her and combined that idea with the blind pilot story.  Their relationship requires them to be together to survive, literally.  Reyna is dependent on Jason's unique bio-signature, while his blindness requires her to defend him from a monstrous predator.

The story did not change in its transition to a movie.  The vision stayed true.


This was a hugely ambitious film for you.  From the very beginning you had planned to do things in ways you hadn't done before.  Let's talk about some of those things, starting with the fact that you chose to shoot this film in Utah rather than Las Vegas.  How did that come about and what was it like shooting in Utah?  (Don't get too much into the behind the scenes day to day stuff here because I'll ask more about it in the next questions.  Just talk about shooting in Utah in general and some of the good and bad things about it.)

My other films have been "shoot and run" or made on private property.  So is the life of guerrilla filmmaking.  I wanted to do EXILE right and get the paperwork that would let us make our movie, without being kicked off the land.  I had planned on shooting in the Valley of Fire, where STAR TREK: GENERATIONS was shot.  However, I could not get permits in Las Vegas, because of an insurance requirement, but Utah was willing to issue us permits.  Monster maker, Scott Lichfield, sent me photos of the area outside of Fillmore.  Magnificent volcanic landscapes!  It was perfect.  There was the extra cost with paying for everyone's gas, food and lodging, on top of $100 per day to the actors, but it was worth it.  

During shooting, we were undisturbed and the look of the land was beautiful.  I've always dreamt of making outdoor adventures and this was it!  The fact that there was no cell phone service in the middle of the desert really made us feel isolated and it worked well for a movie about a marooned character.  There was a sense that we were on a "real" production.  After sundown, we drove back to town, grabbed dinner and returned to our hotel rooms.  10 days of that.  I didn't want the long days and stress that is usually associated with movie shoots.  I made sure that shooting hours didn't go too long.


Equipment limitations were an issue for you when it came to shooting on location in Utah.  What sorts of issues arose from only being able to take so much gear with you?  Did you have any times where you were cursing to yourself and saying, "Damn, I wish I had (such and such) here!"

The equipment was fine, but we were short on crew.  I was trying to hire a knowledgeable Production Assistant, but the people I talked to couldn't make that Utah trip.  That was fine, I would fill the gap, because I thought had a pro Director of Photography lined up.  I guess he hired onto a real job, because he just plain didn't show up or call.  Scott wasn't done making the monster, so he couldn't stay on set, either.  

Fortunately, I hired and flew in Tiffany Sinclair and Brian Sheridan, who had just come off of their own movie, PRAEY.  They became my right and left hands.  Between them and the other actors, we were able to fill in the blanks.  Never had I seen such a complete group of dual purpose actors!  Sheila was also catering and taking care of our 3 kids, including a one year old.  Terry Stover played a soldier and also was our main set builder.  Another soldier, Thanos Panagiotaros, was a freelance videographer.  He saved me, by helping me figure out the P2 workflow.

This was 2007 and we were shooting with the Panasonic HVX200 and P2 cards.  I had no experience with this.  My editing computer just arrived 3 days prior.   We were shooting 1080HD, which records at one gigabyte per minute.  My cards were a 4 and an 8 gig card.  I had a Windows Vista laptop, but Panasonic had not released compatible drivers, yet.  I had to do a USB download from the camera, which meant tying it up, instead of just the card.  Then, just to be sure, I captured the footage visually, into Premiere, via Firewire.  This dual transfer method took me about 40 minutes, each time.  Anyway, what this meant was that I had 12 minutes of memory to shoot before lunchtime (when I transferred) and 12 minutes, between lunch and sundown!  If a shot screwed up, I deleted it.  If someone laughed, I usually deleted it.  I was left with only good takes.

On THE AWAKENING, I shot over 20 hours of footage.  After a 3 week shoot, EXILE had less than 6 hours of footage!!   But, we had our feature in the can (er hard drive).


Let's talk about some of the prep for the film.  You had an idea of what you wanted your monster to look like, but it didn't really end up the way you wanted it.  Tell us about the problems you had with getting it created and ultimately how you ended up working things out with it.

Our first makeup guy quit, so I hired Scott Lichfield in December.  Shooting was scheduled for March 28th, so while he had 4 months, it was tight.  I caught a lot of hell for using that ape suit in TERRARIUM, so I wanted a very different alien.  The original design was a 4 armed, 2 legged reptile with a stinging tail, but no eyes.  It looked very cool.  When Scott came aboard, I told him to go with an insect style endo-skeleton with 6 legs, 14 eyes, a stinging tail, lots of teeth and a bulbous body.  The front side of the body would have at least 4 grabbing tentacles.  The idea was to have 2 performers holding up the monster and operating the 6 legs.  I would remove their real legs in post-production, so that the bulbous body appeared to support itself with the 6 skinny legs; very spider-like.

There is a scene where Jason and Karen talk.  Originally, I wrote that as they talk, the monster appears about 100 feet behind them and quickly crawls towards them.  The whole time, the audience would know what was happening, but the characters didn't, until it was too late.  Time was running out for our Utah window, so we shot with what  Scott was able to provide.  There is nothing more revealing than shooting your monster in daylight!  There is a reason filmmakers shoot their creatures in night shadows.  AVP: REQUIEM took that to a ridiculous extent, judging by the amount of comments I heard from people who wanted to "see" the monsters.  

Shooting daylight was rather bold.  There was no hiding this monster.  People were going to immediately notice that the eyes weren't blinking and that the whole head was static.  I started playing around with it in Photoshop.  I cloned skin on the eyes and made them blink.  I warped his face.  I also added the Plastic Wrap filter, which gave the creature a wet, slimy look.  A little digital interaction with a physical puppet was what was needed.  People seem to really like this monster and as with any monster movie, your movie succeeds or fails on that


Now with this film, you did something you haven't done before.  You paid your actors for their time in Utah including their hotel, the food, etc... in an effort to insure that everyone would be there and ready to go so you could finish shooting everything on schedule.  How did that work out?  Did everyone turn up on time and did you get everything done that you wanted to?

It turned out wonderful.  We stayed in a hotel like a real film crew.  We even met a couple of guys who stayed, en route to working on NATIONAL TREASURE 2.  

It looked bleak, at first.  Sheila, Brian, Tiffany, Heather, the kids and myself arrived the night of March 30th.  There was 6 inches of snow in Fillmore!  I kept a cool exterior, but inside I was freaking out.  The next day, we scouted the volcanic west desert with Scott.  It was only patchy out there, thank goodness.  We settled on a couple of key spots and even shot a snowy scene.  We started with scenes that just had Brian and Heather.  The night of April 1st, the actors playing the soldiers arrived.  One actor wasn't feeling well so he didn't show that night. I got on the phone with him and told him that we really needed him.  It was a 5 hour drive, but he made it up in time.  The soldiers were there for 4 days, playing two different patrols.  They left and then George Miklos (playing Glen) showed up the next day for the fiery shuttle scenes.  George also ended up playing a soldier for some pickup shots.

We stayed 2 extra days and then shot the monster location scenes.  It snowed once and rained another time, but those were fairly short bursts, so the weather was very cooperative.  


You had several people flake on you that had promised you they'd do work for the film.  That had to be really difficult from a morale point of view, not to mention from a logistical one.  How did you deal with that, and who really stepped up to the plate to help out, and in what ways did they contribute to making this film happen?

I had a pretty good idea that the D.P. wasn't coming, because he wasn't returning my messages.  However, everybody had a super attitude and had even had fun!  We were behind on set construction, but this is one area of the movie, where I paid a lot of hired help - like 10 guys.  We learned our lesson, after building TERRARIUM's 64 foot fuselage!  In fact, EXILE was the anti-TERRARIUM.  Whatever went south on that movie, was handily addressed on this one.  Sheila was also well aware of the improved directions we had to go, so being on the same page made things happen.

I was hoping to get one of my more experienced friends to be a P.A. in Utah, but everyone was busy on projects and couldn't get away.  In a way, I was glad that the Director of Photography wasn't showing up.  Though he had a nice big jib crane and all the goodies, we needed to move fast!  There was no time for Hollywood mentality.  We were getting a lot of single takes and moving on.  Traveling light was better.  Brian (the lead actor) and Tiffany were in town for 3 weeks and since 2 days were travel days, we had a 19 day shoot.  Once I learned the P2 workflow (thanks to Thanos), it was only natural for me to direct through a camera.  I think I get better angles that way, especially with the amount of handheld shots we were doing.

The day before Tiffany and Brian flew in, I called her and admitted I was feeling overwhelmed.  She said the best thing, something to the effect of "Don't worry, we'll be there to help finish sets and anything else needed."  That was a powerful phone call and helped put me at ease.  I'm used to being the go to filmmaker, but having Tiffany there meant there would be two people with feature shooting experience.  She is also a filmmaker who is used to doing ten different jobs on her movies.  She got right to work on the cockpit and habitat sets, whipping out the finishing touches.  Her scenes weren't going to be shot for a few days, so she and Thanos were invaluable in getting the ball rolling.

Brian was also incredible.  He was dedicated to doing his part well, but he was drilling walls and organizing everything that had to be loaded up for the trip.  Also stepping up was Paul Folger, TERRARIUM's associate producer.  Paul couldn't be with us on the shoot, but he gave us dolly tracks and got the new computers up and running.  I really wish he could have made that Utah trip as he is an invaluable resource.

Terry Stover, his son, Kevin and my father-in-law, Steven Sprunger were going crazy whipping out the sets.  Terry is kind of accident prone and he went through all of our bandaids!  I don't think he can live without pain, though.  Both him and Steve were relentless perfectionists.  And then there were a couple of guys, Josh Shue and Paul Boyer, who came over and refused to accept pay, for heavy construction work.  All the cool locations that Scott found for us, on his time, and even Scott's mom let us stay in her basement, for a few days.  I should just read the list of the whole cast, because they all put in.

In post-production, James Rogers ended up putting several months into the visual effects.  What people did for this project was rather incredible.

Editor's Note: A bit of trivia here that Mike provided to me after the interview.  He said that he actually met Tiffany Sinclair through Rogue Cinema.  Brian Morton had reviewed her movie Praey and interviewed her as well.  Mike read about her here on Rogue Cinema and was intrigued enough to write to her, asking if she'd be interested in exchanging movies.


Heather Lei Guzzetta stars as the android Reyna in this film, and this isn't the first film of yours she's appeared in.  What's it like working with her and what does she bring to the table as an actress that makes her so special?

Obviously, Heather has a striking look.  Even better, is that Heather is a professional.  Outside of my wife, Sheila, Heather is the most dependable actor I've worked with.  She is also masking an inner-geek, who loves robots, sci-fi, horror and wearing costumes.  I had her dub some lines from the script and they sounded exactly like the ones we didn't have good audio of.  That's a real asset, when an actor can hit the notes from a recording booth or closet.  There's a certain energy and curiousity when she is on set.  She is a quiet person, whose expression hides the fact that she is having so much fun.  As you get to know her, you realize she is a child at heart, having the time of her life.  I've worked on enough projects with people who didn't want to be there, so I deeply appreciate this quality of person..  A few years ago, I pledged to work only with people who want to be there.  This cast fit the bill.


I had joked with you on the phone, asking you if your wife Sheila irritated you or something, because she's always being abused or killed in your films.  The answer you gave me wasn't really what I was expecting, but it was really funny.  Tell us about Sheila and her idea of a dream film role.  Also, have you been planning any scenes like that for her in an upcoming film?

I discovered Sheila's toughness, on ROADKILL, where she plays a maniac who gets knocked down, run over and keeps getting back up.  She loved it when I would throw dirt in her face and rough up her look.  Her dream role would be to do what Patricia Arquette did, in TRUE ROMANCE - the scene where James Gandolfini beats the living hell out of her, smashing her through the shower glass, etc, and then she kills him!  Sheila wants to do something where she is getting beat up, in some kind of death struggle, then pulling through it.  

In THE AWAKENING, Sheila plays a mugging victim.  She went up to the mugger, Marcus Smith, and told him to really throw her on the pavement.  All this, without my knowledge.  Fortunately, Marcus didn't go full force on her.  She does like the physical stuff and I'll just have to grant her wish someday.  She'll probably win an oscar.  Sheila's a special person.  She never acted in anything in the 31 years before she met me, but she has talent in her.


Let's talk a little about music now.  You do all the music for your films and from what I recall, you have more synthesizers in your house than most music stores have on the sales floor, including Korg's flagship (and incredibly expensive) synth, the Oasys.  How long have you been playing, and what are the boards that you currently own?  Also, have you used all of them at various times to do your scoring, or do you have some that really lend themselves to it while others...not so much?

I had trouble finding composers who could give me "movie music."  I bit the bullet and bought a Yamaha DX7, in 1984.  I was a one fingered typist, but eventually I started figuring out how to play.  My sister got the piano lessons.  I've been into synths, ever since.  I currently have the OASYS, Access Virus TI, Roland Fantom FA, Roland JP-8000, E-MU E4K, E-MU Pro/Cussion drum module, Yamaha SY99, Yamaha A5000 and two TX16W samplers, Alesis NanoBass, Ensoniq VFX SD, some hardware FX processors and some software.

On the score for THE AWAKENING, I also had a couple of Tritons, so I hooked up about 12 synths/samplers for that score.   I used slightly less for TERRARIUM, but I pretty much used most of what I had.  I would make huge string layers, by mixing 5 different keyboards together.  Same with the brass.  I was getting some pretty big sounds.


Tell us about the whole scoring process and how the Oasys has helped to streamline it for you.

I always thought it would be cool, if I could compose music from one main keyboard, without needing computers.  I have found that with the OASYS.  I sampled a few of the sounds from my other gear and now the OASYS really is full of my best sounds.  Because it has a Pentium 4 processor inside, it can load large amounts of sample data in seconds  It is computer fast, but still has the layout of a Korg workstation.  Typically, I'll take days to just select the sounds I'm using for a score.  Every movie needs its own palette of sounds.  For EXILE I assembled a combination of orchestral and otherworldly synth sounds.  It makes for a nice mix.

I record the Virus TI directly into the OASYS, to audio tracks.  When I'm finished with a Song, I have the OASYS make a .wav file of it.  I pull out a small jump drive, plug into the computer and drop the songs into Premiere.  The good thing is that I'm avoiding mixers and noisy audio cables.  Internal mixdown to .wav and I'm done.  Not everybody gets on with that keyboard the way I do, but it has really helped my sound, which is what you heard on the soundtrack.


You're rather well known in Oasys circles, and have even done a highly acclaimed instructional DVD for it.  Tell us what that DVD covers and how those who are lucky enough to own an Oasys can pick themselves up a copy.  Also, are you planning on making any more of those or did you cover everything already in the one you've already done?

Korg recently discontinued the OASYS line, but I'm far from done with it.  My DVD is a 3 hour, 17 minute tutorial about how to get started going through program banks, Global functions and the general interface.  There are also some recording, sampling, vocoding and other examples on the DVD.  To answer your question, I barely scratched the surface of what it can do, so I will be releasing another DVD, soon.  The new DVD will cover Combi settings, synth engine parameters, the amazing bus system, disc functions,  how to burn CDs on the unit itself and much more.  Like the first disc, the new one will be available at my www.midnightsunent.com website.


How are you going to handle the distribution for Exile?  Are you going to look for a distributor or are you going to self distribute...or have you decided yet?

I have a producer's rep who shops the movie.  Japan has already bought it, Thailand said they want it, and there is also a deal with Comcast Video On Demand.  I will also be selling "Director's Edition" copies through the midnightsunent website.  That version will include a behind the scenes doc, called OFF WORLD.  I've been saving the customer files of people who ordered my previous DVDs, so I will be letting them know the movie is available.  The world economy is still shaky, so distributors are really giving us low ball offers.  I would just assume selling my own collection of DVDs, rather than take a low U.S. deal.  If there is a good offer, that's different.  Either way, I should be okay.


What are the pros and cons of both finding a distributor and self distributing?  I've heard that indie film makers don't often get very good deals from the distributors.  Is that generally the case?

If you don't have a name actor in your movie, distributors will low ball you.  Since I have a small base of people to market the movie to, I can do okay.  I'll be happy to take a cheap domestic distro offer, after I sell my own, for about a year.  The better your movie is and the hotter the genre, the more countries you can sell to.  This has been, and continues to be, such a strong sci-fi year.  From the success of STAR TREK, to the hype of James Cameron's AVATAR, I'm feeling pretty good about releasing a movie in that genre.
 

Are you sending Exile out to any film festivals?

It played at Xanadu Las Vegas.  I'm still debating on others,


You recently hosted another Indie Meet in Las Vegas.  Tell us about those and what kinds of things go on over the course of the weekend.  I've always wanted to attend one, and hopefully next year I'll be able to come.  Even though I'm not actually a film maker, I may still have something to contribute.  It always looked like it would just be a really fun time in any case.

You don't have to be a filmmaker to come to IndieMeet.  We get artists, actors, writer/reviewers and anyone interested in the business.  The  event happens every Memorial Day weekend (typically May).  It is 3 days long.  

Friday starts off with hors d' oeuvres, homemade chocolate chip cookies and many other delights, prepared by my wife and former executive chef, Sheila.  We have 2 hours of simple meet and greet.  When it gets dark, we project movies outside, on a 10 foot screen and some big speakers.  I usually preselect an indie movie that I either made or want to watch.  In 2008, we had 4 features.  Sometimes, there are just one or two.  The guests are welcome to bring their short films, which we'll play.  Saturday afternoon, for about 6 hours, we engage in demos and presentations, ranging from stunt sword fights, how to make blood, makeup effects, weapons, making a group effort short movie, you name it!  Come nightfall, we go outside and watch more indie movies.  On Sunday, we attend a matinee of a Hollywood film, then we have a barbecue and swim party.  When nightfall comes........yes, we gather around the firepit and watch more movies!  Those who are more interested in networking often group up, inside.  

The whole point of the event is that there is no pressure.  We usually put up some overnighters and we stay up pretty late into the morning.  You come network, meet nice people, learn something about the craft and see some cool flicks, while staying interactive.  The Xanadu people admitted that they want their next festival to be like IndieMeet!  The fest director called it "Relaxacon".  


You've been getting your kids involved a bit in your film making.  One of them even narrated the beginning of Exile.  That's gotta be really cool for you as a father having them involved, even in small ways.  It also has to create some problems here and there, as kids aren't generally known for having long attention spans or an even temperament.  Tell us about some of your experiences with having them on set and involved in small ways here and there.

Yeah, Carmen sounds great on that narration.  Every once in a while, you get a screaming kid and me yelling, "Quiet on the set!"  In one shot, the soldiers are huddled behind a bush and talking about a plan of action.  In the far background, Sheila walk across the screen, because the Shawn left his sister in the desert, somewhere.  While we were staying in the hotel, our baby, Chris, swallowed a penny.  We thought he passed it, but one month later, the doctor saw it in an X-ray.  Another day, Shawn and Carmen walk up holding dismembered coyote paws and legs!  Some hunter blew the coyote away and the kids came walking up with the remains.  There's nothing they don't get into.  As they get older, I'm able to get more out of them.  Both of them were on microphone duty, with the pistol gripmount.


Have you thought about what you want to do for your next film yet?  Any teasers you can throw our way as to what we can expect?

I want to do a horror movie with a monster.  No sci-fi, but rather something set in the everyday world.  With the new flick, I want to strive for more realistic situations than you can get on an underfunded spaceship set.  I don't want budget to be a factor with what people see.  With sci-fi, you settle on some things.  I want to make a movie, where you can't tell what the budget of it is.


Is there anything else you'd like to talk about or mention before we wrap this up?

Are you kidding?  I feel like I just birthed a novel!

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If you'd like to pick up a copy of Exile or any of Mike's other great films, you can check out the order page on his website at http://www.midnightsunent.com/orderdvds.php.